Archived podcast for paid Subscribers only. Please login to access.It began with chronic synchronicities and déjà vu. It became slips in time, repeats of events, and shifts into a parallel world almost exactly the same but slightly off. In fact, that world may be our world. And Shawn may not be from here. If he didn’t think about that before this interview, he’s thinking about it now.
Afterwards, exclusively for subscribers, host Jeremy Vaeni draws upon his own experiences to bring us deep into the controversial question of psychedelics as a possible means for transcendence.
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Another great interview with
Another great interview with corn-Shawn. I’m looking forward to the next bit.
Now to continue with the psychedelic monologue…
Being interested in this kind of stuff but not brave enough to try any of these types of drugs, I remember looking on YouTube where this person took LSD in the presence of a doctor…the person who had taken the drugs sometime earlier, suddenly said “You’re still here!?” to the doctor, whereupon they explained they had been in a state of pure bliss for what they estimated to be about five thousand years! Now that’s one heck of a distraction and must give you an interesting new perspective on life. Another story I heard in person was from someone who took LSD and in that trip was the only person in a world of dinosaurs 🙂 not exactly transformative but certainly interesting. I was just wondering, with regards to the full ‘I am’ experience…is it possible for someone to have that experience and not get it?…or does the fact that they had the experience of being ‘consciousness transcending and including all things’ automatically mean they got it? Does that make sense?
always a good show, Jeremy.
always a good show, Jeremy.
Sherbet UFO, your questions ….How interesting and yes, it makes sense to me, at least.
Jeremy, i swear i heard this show before…and that you raised these questions (in the last part of your monologue) before. I was asking myself… a time slip? me????
I have never taken any psychedelic stuff. No interest nor curiosity. However, some fear that i could change and somehow not be able to be “me” anymore. Probably a result of seeing folks who were “drugged out” along the streets, and later the vets stories after they returned from Nam.
I came to understand that a my “experiences” fit into the mystical category. For a long time, i didn’t know that such a category existed. And i asked people if they ever had such and such happen (not a lot of info so they wouldn’t know why i was asking).
For the longest time, since no one ever spoke of them, i felt quite “outside.”
When i told my mother about one of my experiences (when i was possibly 7) she told me to never tell anyone. I didn’t know why… but believed she must be right… so i didn’t til i told my husband. He didn’t know what i was talking about. Belonging still was something i wanted, and yet, had. I was inside and outside at the same time. Probably the same as everyone else as they grow up. I was aware of being different… and yet -same. Human in every way.
I felt alone because there was no one who understood, and that was clear by their answers to my questions. I guess that is normal while growing up and until one “finds” where one “belongs.” My search – therefore – was to belong. I was somewhat afraid of not belonging at all, if people knew i was different… so secret experiences would be a good description.
During all these years, i felt deeply loved and cared about by many people and by God. I identified with everyone in what it is to be human… All lives consist of some things and the specifics are variable. But everyone eats, sleeps, loves, learns, cares about others, etc. All the variations are beautiful and special ways that make each person a “gift” and it adds to understanding and appreciation of self as well.
Experiences of Oneness are probably as varied as the number of beings there are. I have come to appreciate the sameness and the differences of each person i know.. as each blade of grass, drop of water, smile in another’s eyes, joy in the first breath of a newborn, and all the other moments of life which reveal and conceal at the same time. Revealing as much as i am open to “see” and “let in” and experience Belonging to a Whole which is Oneness. yet cannot be “known.”
Words fail and yet, not completely.
Thanks for asking us to respond.
Thanks for taking the time to
Thanks for taking the time to respond Jeremy. Having not taken psychedelics yet having had mystical experiences I think there was some confusion or curiosity on my part as to weather they could take me to the same place. It makes sense that they wouldn’t since the mystical experience is only an ‘experience’ in the sense that the remnants of it fill the place normally occupied by the term ‘experience’, but what it really is is a shift of identity away from the ego to what lies beyond, while psychedelics maintain the experience/experiencer dichotomy which is always in the realm of ego.
Love you Jeremy but the way
Love you Jeremy but the way you consistently oversimplify and misrepresent the Seth material is frankly bizarre at this point and always reaffirms how little of it you must have read (especially considering how your warning against seeing certain drugs as a shortcut to inner knowing could have been paraphrased from The Nature of Personal Reality).
Another great show. I have
Another great show. I have enjoyed Shawn’s frank and casual reporting. A calm and balanced attitude is key to this whole journey.
And to Jeremy: much gratitude.
Regarding the topic of hallucinogens, my one experience was very profound and has given me much to ponder about Life.
I have always felt connected to nature, being out in the woods, rushing down a hill running, skiing, biking on country trails, etc. I have been meditating for 40 years and teaching now for over 30 years, so I am no stranger to deep transcendental experiences.
I have done lsd once, and felt all the connections I have ever felt, with the added dimension of being able to “see” the light bundles of people and trees. The acid experience was just an extension of all I read, experienced and felt all these years.
I think by far two things stood out. First my guide and I were deeply connected to one another – a profound heart centered connection that remains with us both to this day. The second great experience was my strong connection to all the mature trees in the forest, both individual trees and groups. To feel their collective awareness was a strong experience, and to see the fibrous energy streaming in, up, down and around each tree, and between trees, was a very moving experience.
Yet again, I want to state clearly that over the years, in casual hikes, or in deliberate meditations, I have experienced these connections without any aid. Calm and relaxed, in a deeper meditative state, I think it is a natural state available to us all.
I have wondered how I would have fared had I not all my previous experiences and training to call upon as I began this crazy rush. And, once you swallow the tab, there’s no stopping the experience. My trip lasted 8 hours. I also had a guide who stayed with me the entire time, kept me safe, kept me walking, kept me hydrated, and kept me from stalking other humans!
The old adage “Your mileage may vary” should be taken seriously. Don’t trip alone is another great suggestion, and I am damn glad I had my friend alongside me.
But, as Jeremy stated in his segment of this show, repeat and addictive use is a distraction. I am not discounting serious use multiple times under guidance, especially for PTSD therapy. But casual use should be limited, IMHO.
Blessings,
John
Maybe being in Soy Bean Field
Maybe being in Soy Bean Field World ain’t so hot, and I am also trying to figure out how I got here too! Having had a whole slew of odd experiences, synchronicities, and what I can only call ‘time slips’, lately I have felt like Dorothy wandering around lost in OZ, wanting nothing more than to go ‘home’ again! Several days ago, I told my sweetheart that for a while now, I feel like I am not in the right ‘place’ (Spacetime? Universe? Timeline?). It’s an odd feeling, and while I would like to think that I am exactly where I am supposed to be and all is right with the world, I am not ‘feeling it’, despite any philosophy being doled about by New Agers…
Regarding drugs and psychedelics, I simply have never felt a need for them. I have experiences of all kinds without them, plus I am able to stay lucid, and that is important for me, as is being grounded. I question my experiences a lot as it is, so why would I want to add another layer of uncertainty via a drugged state? While I do not feel that I have something to prove about my experiences, it means a lot to me that the people that I love and care about the most, that also know me well, don’t have that area of possible doubt to deal with themselves regarding me. It is about my own sense of authenticity and personal integrity. And as cliche as it sounds, it is about the journey, and one without shortcuts and quick fixes, and everything and everyone is on that journey with me. I don’t want to miss a moment of it due to a mind and body ‘under the influence’. I am also lucky in that I have always felt connected to everything. Yes, I get angry, politics frustrate me, and I don’t always have the kindest thoughts, nor am I the best person that I can be. I am a work in progress, and that’s fine with me.
What a great episode Jeremy
What a great episode Jeremy and Shawn, thank you. The soy bean timeline jump is a real head f**k ;0) Leaving your loved ones in the old timeline is something I’ve never thought of before and has very deep and frankly, serious implications!!
Regarding psychedelics I’ve had my fair share of them and pretty much everything else. I don’t really do them any more as I’m a middle aged family man, but they certainly have been very influential in changing the way I look at the world. Are they a doorway to the same place, who knows, but they have in my experience been a force for good. The only problem I would say concerning them is that I have had some minor odd experiences/dreams but can’t be certain if they were influenced by drugs still sloshing around my system or not.
But then again it makes sense if all these strange happenings are experienced through the mind/consciousness then taking psychedelics probably does take you to the same place albeit in a less controlled state. Our body produces DMT every day (in the early hours of the morning) and some people may naturally produce a little more of this than others. Much like some people don’t produce enough serotonin and wonder around all day feeling down, while others seem to find joy in everything they see. Psychedelics certainly could explain the revolution in early mans consciousness when cavemen stumbled across magic mushrooms? Maybe they are a tool to kick-start our awareness, then it’s up to us to take it to the next level on our own?
I’m currently fascinated by lucid dreaming. We’ll see where that takes me ;0)
Keep up the good work…let’s go!
When you are out of your body
When you are out of your body – as in out of body experience, or dead – you can put all the chemicals and plant medicine and blah blah you want into your head and you won’t even notice. The plant medicine does not astral travel with you, lol. Right there that should tell you something. The body is merely an interface. Drugs might let some of the astral body’s perceptual abilities leak into the physical, but the subconscious is clearly mucking those perceptions up along the way. If this were a desirable state for our consciouness to be in, then we’d want it 24 hours a day. Who among the psychedelic users want that?
Let’s say you have to drive a child to school. Would you rather be in a true, genuine state of higher consciousness, which would allow you to see around the corners in the road, attune to the traffic and weather and dangers up ahead, allowing you to do an even better job of driving? Allowing you to psychically read the child’s mind, and discuss any anxieties he might have, and physically attune what a helpful comment would be to him? Or you would you think being stoned on Iboga is a better way to get your kid to school?
And……..everyone I know who does A regularly has become much more egotistical, all the while claiming they are so much less so: they babble on incessantly about their new discoveries and insights into and about their egos.
DMT? Even the guy who wrote the book “DMT The Spirit Molecule” has admitted he was just speculating on what DMT actually does, or it’s role in neurochemistry. Try instead an article called “The case against DMT elves” James Kent.
I’m no skeptic, but rather suggest meditation as a far superior way to travel.
But then, maybe I’m wrong about all the above.
Jack Blaylock I think you’re
Jack Blaylock I think you’re right about drugs being a dangerous rabbit hole. I’ve just read the article by James Kent and think it’s spot on! I do value my drug taking experiences as being a first step to look at the world around me with open eyes. Those days are well in the past now and I still haven’t got a clue what the f**k is going on, but nowadays I’m cool with that.
So thanks for the link Jack, and thanks Jeremy, Shawn, and everyone who posted. What a great show and thread this has been :0)
Jeremy,
I like the way you
Jeremy,
I like the way you think about things and your rambling rant was perfect. Thanks.
Agree Benchmark! When I saw
Agree Benchmark! When I saw the subject the first thing that went to my mind was one of the Seth books that explains so eloquently reasons against seeing certain drugs as a shortcut. As I grow older and read more, I value the Seth material
more and more. It just gets deeper. A real gem.
I have got to get my two
I have got to get my two cents in on this psychedelics thing. Full disclosure, I have not yet tried Ayahuasca.
As far as psychedelic vs mystical experiences go, apples and oranges. Both alter your perception of reality, but with psychedelics you know exactly why, even during the experience. If you take psychedelics, you better want to have a psychedelic experience, because that is the only thing that is guaranteed. If you begin a psychedelic experience with the sole expectation of having a mystical experience, chances are, like Jeremy said, you will be disappointed and looking for an early exit when there ain’t one. Well put Jeremy.
Having said that, anyone who is curious and game, and game does not mean being talked into it, should try it (with good friends, at least one of which should be knowledgeable, blah, blah, blah). I have found it to be a very enjoyable way to share a unique and memorable experience with friends. I have never taken hallucinogens with a mindful, serious agenda or intent. That approach sounds like a buzzkill to me. I did watch little beads of light zipping around between the tiles in the bathroom once. It was fascinating and super cool to watch. If I had not been ripped on LSD at the time I would have considered it mystical, but under the circumstances I assumed it was the drugs.